Sacramento 3-day complete!

Message #934 of 942

I just completed the 3-day in Sacramento and it rocked! Just as Dan mentioned
in his 3-day I took a full pad and a half worth of notes.

Lots and lots of great information. I was a little worried going in as some
people on this forum had said they didn't like their trainers. But there were
enough people on this forum that really liked the training that I chose to go.
And that was a smart move.

The 2 trainers were excellent. Knowledgeable, funny and committed to everyone
getting a lot out of the training. One was an older man that has been an
investor for 30 years. The second was previously a police officer 9 years ago.
Between the two of them they related deals ranging from single family homes to
apartmenet complexes to small commercial buildings to Donald Trump style office
buildings.

They brought all this down to earth giving very specific instructions on how
to negotiate a deal and how to find the money to finance it including using the
seller's money. On the final day we looked through several newspapers and
publications to find "motivated sellers". Very useful for me to see how I could
find my own deals in the paper.

I met Dale for the second time during the training. Hi Dale:) Very nice guy
and always willing to help. Dale has a lot of energy to say the least! That
explains why he can respond in so much length to all the posts. But none the
less, nice guy, willing to do anything to help you out. As Dale mentioned a
week or two ago he NOW DOES work for NRI.

So the training was great. Now the question is, how will the students use the
information. While I was a little nervous I contacted a seller in my area the
next day that happened to be selling multiple properties out of state that
looked like a good deal just from the ad. I've been talking to him for 2 days
now getting more information and he may carry back 10% of the down payment!
That's sweet! I'll post more information when I get an accepted contract.

So, those of you that are on the fence as far as whether the training is worth
it or not, I'd say jump in and give it a whirl. Of course the training is only
the first step. As they repeatedly said during the training, "the real training
starts on day 4". And I believe that. They give you the tools to work with and
now you've got to use them to find some good deals.

That's all for now,
Greg

3day workshop...one person's experience in atlanta

Well I made it through the 3 day workshop
with a zillion pages of notes with web
site addresses given to us today, where
you can find deals and check out properties
without having to see them in person.
I'm very very satsfied with the workshop.
They never really pushed the M5 or other
workshops very much. Very low key which
I liked concerning the other workshops.
However they did give you a ton
of ways to make money and some creative
ways to get financing. If a 22 year old
(who I met) can buy 33 properties in
basically 8 to 9 months (he owns them
all), I think I can get a few if I take
the time to apply what I've learned and
absorb what I've heard over the last 3 days.
Yes, I made several more contacts today and a couple
of people I will probably end up doing some
deals with. Now it's on-ward to the coaching,
which I had signed up for originally with the
workshop. So far so good to my surprise.

Dan

My 2days so far at the Atlanta workshop..

Well I hate to admit it but I definitely have
gotten my money's worth with not only the contacts
I've made at the workshop but also with the vast
wealth of knowledge that has been given to us
by Ryan Smith and Joline who I guess it's about
4 times a bigger a player than Ryan. She does
25 REO's a month in the 7 figures not to mention
many other deals she's working on. By the way,
they have given us locations and prices etc... on
their deals. I have been very very impressed with the workshop
and have learned a ton. I've got 47 pages of notes
with a day still left to go. By the way, I asked
Ryan Smith point blank if Dale in any way worked
for NRI or James Smith and the answer was a
sincere no so that should put to rest some past
questions that had been raised about Dale working for
James Smith. I went to lunch with a young kid today who
is around 22 years old and took the workshop and M5 just
last year. Guess what? He now owns 33 properties!!!
Never had real estate experience before. Wow!

Dan

MORE POINTED QUESTIONS...

Touche, Michael.  That is all I have been asking, and many others.

  I was sitting in that class with people in the bad credit boat with me and it
is INFINITELY harder, not IMPOSSIBLE, it just takes more work and the hard money
numbers decrease the number of available deals.  YES money matters to us.  YES
feeding our kids is high on the list of why we consider carefully the value of
$3k or $6k spent...for me that would be CASH.  I don't have a credit card.  AND
as badly as I want to beLIEve in what I could learn at M5, I need some solid
proof that it is worth $18k to gamble (plus travel costs).

  Dale thinks I am an unteachable know it all.  He is wrong.  Quite the
contrary.  I am a sponge, if someone is truly TEACHING, not standing around
bragging showing no way to follow what they did to do what they have done.

  BUT, I am also cautious and want to know what I am spending money on, you do
this with properties, right?  Education is an investment and it too must be
quantified.

  The great and powerful OZ was really just a little man behind a curtain,
wasn't he?   And, didn't the rats just follow the Pied Piper cuz he played a
catchy tune?

  I asked my teacher at the 3 day this question:  "If you had $800k from a
building you just sold and you had to spend it by July, what would you do?"

  She said, "First I wouldn't put it in a 1031, that is too restrictive.  All
you have to do to avoid the capital gains tax is reinvest it within 9 months on
another income property."

  Well, 3 CPAs and 1 Tax Attorney have said NO WAY.  There is no tax shelter
like that and when the IRS catches up with you, you will pay the capital gains
tax.  That is a $160k mistake!!!!  Right out of the NRI 3 Day, from a
Millionaire Investor!!

  She also said we could use a 1033 or a 531.  1033 = condemned property-in a
nutshell....Am yet to find what a 531 is!!!  Does anyone here know?

  The answer I expected was something like:
  What is your goal? Cashflow? Upside?  Long term? Short term?
  Is that all gain?  yes.  Then it has to be a 1031 so you have to get going.
  Can't do new construction on long term build outs...won't close in six
months...hmmmm...  well... (Location) is going to be pretty hot really quickly,
but you can still get a good buy.  The rental market it good so, I think I would
buy 1 apartment building there and a NNN in a new business park in Phoenix...the
best place to get your tenant is ______ for the NNN.   And, I would find a good
management co for the apartment right out of the gate since it is far away from
you.   But, she dodged this question 3 times...as did the guys in the back of
the room, 2 who were supposed to be doing so well with their new found skills.
They just kept giving me a bunch of BS about how my client should be doing this
for herself.  I said, I paid the money for your guidance, I have the time to
come, I teach her.  So, what do you have for me?  Glazed over looks, that's what
I got.

  NEXT... there is a woman/student who NRI likes evidently traveling to all of
their 3 days.  They introduce her, she is charming and really beLIEves what she
has learned there.    She has James' phone number in her cell phone.  She loves
the guy!!!  BUT, she has been involved in the mentor program and they have
helped her to lose out on 3 deals that I could have mentored easily AND, are you
ready???  SHE LOST HER OWN HOUSE while affiliated as a paying student of NRI!!!!
No one in this benevolent organization helped her with that!!!   WHY?   She had
income.  They could have done an RTO with her, a quitclaim and cure....come on
guys anything!!!    To my knowledge, in two years she has yet to put together a
deal.  The easiest one, she should have made $5k minimum for having sold the
contract and secured her position in doing so, but no one could help her with
that basic deal to insure she got paid.  BTW, that one alone could have saved
her house.

  This is the TRUE basis of my skepticism and it goes on and on.

  There was also 1/2 a day on foreclosures which was taught using another
state's terminology, procedures and timelines.  That is totally irresponsible
for this level of expense.

  $1,500 per student, unless like me you paid $3,000 cuz u don't have a partner.
But let's give them the benefit of the doubt.  There were 50 people in my class.
That is $75k in income in 3 days, they do this many weekends per month in many
cities.  To us, it was about $80.00 per hour. Double that if you came alone.
The room and AV were not so great.  And, there was coffee, tea and water, that
is it.  Not even a snack.  Low class, if you ask me.    I am all for GOOD
training.

  I could help make this training good, so could another guy who actually does
train who was  in my class.  He approached the teacher with a bunch of
suggestions and she shunned him.   She told him her pay structure and then she
belittled everyone in the class saying, "look at these people, they don't get it
anyway, you can't throw too much at them".      She also told me, "I am ignoring
your questions because these people can't handle too many details right now, I
don't want them to get confused."  That is a pretty condescending attitude
against people who are paying your organization some pretty good coin to be
there, don't you think?

  That is CRAP.  All she needed to do was a few basic deals, take all the
questions the room had and teach the deal.  Teach finding, negotiating,
contracting, financing, closing, and exit strategy on a 6 different types of
deals in those 3 days and she would have had many scrounging up that M5 money.
Instead, I think 5-7 went for it.
  Also, they might have gone home and made that money easily so it would have
been easy to go on to the M5.

  PS I wrote these details and more to Dale in private, out of courtesy and
respect, in case I was just wrong about being unable to verify the deals.  He
ignored the WHOLE thing.  As an insider, it should have been easy for him to at
least check into the details of some deals she mentioned that I researched and
found nothing about.  But Dale, who has the link to JS didn't even respond that
mail.  It would have taken less time for him to do that than it does to dissect
every post on here.

  That's it.

  ***Can anyone tell me about a 3 day that was more than just a "Let's go kill
some birds, I am psyched-fest?"   Did anyone find out where the birds live and
what kind of weapons/rounds to use, what time of day?   How to cook the birds?

  LJ

POINTED QUESTIONS ABOUT JAMES SMITH AND NRI EXPERIENCE

From: "Michael Knight" Date: Mon May 29, 2006 6:23 pm Subject: JSMITH, DALE, SALESMEN, REI... POINTED QUESTIONS...

Dale, I will say one thing about you.  I don't know you, I don't know where you
are from, I don't know what you do for a living, I know you read a lot of books
and watch a lot of movies due to your multiple erroneous quotes that you think
prove a point, but the one thing I do know is that you are a hell of a salesman,
I really can tell that.  RE is for salesman.  This is about sales.  That takes a
certain personality to do effectively, and from what I can tell most people
getting involved in JS and his program do not possess these skills, but they
were "sold" on the fact that REI is for anyone who wants to be rich.  Show me
one realtor/REI/broker/etc with no sales skills.  I guarantee you that most of
the JS skeptics on this forum do not have sales in their skill set.  So the
skeptics here want actual info on RE deals - not addresses, SS#'s, etc, but just
details of deals.

What about that deal made you money?

What angle did you take and why?

What were all of the circumstances that brought you a deal and made you take it?

These are questions the skeptics want answered.  That doesn't exist here.  You
continue to defend JS until you are blue in the face but instead of talking
about what He taught you we simply hear that unless you have met Him you have no
voice.  There are hundreds of thousands of RE people doing business every day
that have not met Him, yet the world keeps spinning.  I have asked you before
why this forum is so personal to you.  Why do you dissect every negative JS post
sentence by sentence (like you will this one I'm sure), word by word, and avoid
credible RE info, only to boil it down to have you or have you not met Him?
People are simply asking you a little bit about what you were taught by Him to
see if they want to get involved.  But you never talk about real estate.  You
say meet him, pay 3K, 6K, 20K, whatever, go to a M5, go to the Vegas show, see
JS do it personally.  You don't discuss real estate.  Notice a theme here?  You
are selling JS and NRI.  Why?  What's in it for you?  If you go the route you
have previously and claim to just want to spread the good word then why sell
people on spending money.  Why not teach more people, help them, answer their
questions, show them the way, but don't have the end all answer be "meet Him",
talk to people about RE. You are selliing this program. You are selling JS.  And
while on the subject of JS, you DID include him in the same breath with Ghandi
and JC in a previous post, so let's get back to earth here.  The guy is a hell
of a salesman, and so are you, but why do you incredulously think you have
credibility here?  You are just as anonymous here as anyone else so what makes
you the authority here that represents JS and NRI?  To quote Dale - "I have meet
Him, I sell RE from what he taught me, you can too."  Really?  How do we know?
This is why people think you are a shill, and objectively you should understand
why.  You say very little to prove otherwise.  Honestly, I would guess the
majority of people on this forum see JS and NRI as a scam.  Wait, that is too
harsh, not a scam.  A program taught by a person who did well that shows others
to do the same.  Do they keep records?  What percentage of students experience
independent wealth in a matter of years?  A solid figure there would sell this
program better than anything else. 1 out of 5, 10, 100, 1000, 10000, 100000,
what is it?  The TV commercials for REI (same as this but on TV) say
"non-typical results" when the testimonials fly.  This is all sales.

I will say one more thing you will appreciate Dale, a movie quote.  This is from
Tommy Boy. "Hey, I can take a shit in a box and stamp it guaranteed, but what
are you buying?  A guaranteed piece of shit, that's what you are buying."


Cheers.

MIT NRI HIT The National News Scene

What Can We Say! Here is a direct Link to the Video from FOX 11 News in Los Angeles, California.

This video is disturbing and controversial and does not necessarily represent James Smith, however it does represent MIT or MONEY IN TRAINING and DON PENDELTON, WHO THEY SAY IS THE PRESIDENT OF THE COMPANY.
We are not going to comment on the video, other than to say that this is VERY surprising!

Find the link HERE to view. Go to the forum for feedback or to voice your perspective!

The Learning Annex Real Estate Wealth Expo

THE LEARNING ANNEX
I just attended this past weekend's Learning Annex Real Estate Wealth Expo at the Los Angeles Convention Center. It was my first time to the Learning Annex's gig, and boy do they MAKE SOME SERIOUS MONEY OFF THAT EVENT!!

VOTED #1 SPEAKER
I also had the opportunity to hear our Voted #1 and endorsed by the president of the Learning Annex as the best speaker... James Smith! Since the last time I heard him about two years ago, he has nicely improved his presentation! His style is still effective with the crowds (if not more so now). Unlike like last time, he did start off by saying that he wasn't going to "pimp books or tapes" to the audience (to which the crowd CHEERED). so, in the end he (technically and literally) really did not sell any books or tapes, BUT he did manage to sell $6,000.00 seminars to the crowd! :)

When I look back on the event, there were only two people on stage who literally and technically did not try to sell ANYTHING - suze orman and donald trump! if anything, maybe they were just selling themselves, BUT the crowd didn't have to go to the tables to buy anything from orman or trump.

JAMES SMITH PRESENTATION
Getting back to "James Smith Fulltime Real Estate Investor," as he described himself in the presentation, did very well to connect with the audience by these factors:

sense of humor;
casual style of how he presented himself (using a stool really helped convey the image);
his borderline topics and comments - careful not to insult anyone, yet making sure to make up for it by making fun of himself (w/calling himself a cracker, redneck, or dumb);
pumping up people's esteem (there's no one better than you!);
good use of casual slang;
covering poignant topics of giving back to the community

THE SAME 'OLE, SAME 'OLE...
he did a FANTASTIC job moving the crowd. and then he gave the good 'ol funny timeless examples in the context that sounded like they happened the other nite or very recently:

1. the lady who started a nonprofit and buys homes for children who need shelter;
2. the old cranky denny waitress who rents;
3. the doing a deal in his underwear at the hotel he stayed at;
4. the advice he gave his mom about what to do w/her retirement package;
5. the three sons stories, the helping the garbage man out and being invited to the garbage man's family bbq... he even addressed someone's comment from OUR FORUM :) (but of course didn't specify where the criticism came from) about how stupid someone was for criticizing him about doing physical labor by working in his garden - and how gardening was what he enjoyed and not regarded as "physical labor... duhhhh."

great stories!

NEW AND IMPROVED!
What was new to his presentation was the indian reservations and encouraging native american indians in buying back "what's theirs"; the 1033 transfer to 503c (nonprofit) strategy - maybe he mentioned it in his speech back in 2004, but i don't recall... after all, we only use 8% of our brains as he also mentioned in his pitch.

at the end of his presentation he spoke of taking action... "getting in the game" and i can COMPLETELY AGREE with that. We need to take consistent action in getting ourselves educated in how to become financially independent. He definitely did a good job of selling himself. and of course, when he sells himself effectively, everyone who buys into him will be compelled to buy into what's associated with him... a 3day "bootcamp" seminar!

...to be continued..

Fear does have a purpose

Great post John Michael... I'd like to add the following: Courageous people
experience fear all the time, but they do not let it stop them from pursuing
their dreams/goals....

If I had let fear stop me 6 months ago, i would still be renting instead of
owning three properties, I would not have started my own LLC, and I would not
be  about to close on my fourth property next week! I would not be planning on
quitting my $90,000 a year job within 3 years to invest in RE full time
while  living off the net profits from the business.

Without fear there is no courage...
remember that next time you feel fear, it is what it is... an emotion and
nothing more, it a point of decision, make the right one! Our lives are shaped
by the choices we make.. even when we choose not to choose... that is a
choice.

you have a choice to either operate in courage or be discouraged... in  other
words to allow fear to make choices for you... or to see fear for what it
is, an emotion  to make you pause... don't get stuck in the pause.. move
forward!!!!

- annakaela@...

RE Fear is a great motivator

Fear can become your biggest asset!

 Fear can be a draw back when seeking an education in real estate investing but
you can turn this fear into one of your biggest assets.

 How many times have you wanted to get into real estate, only to have that
voice in your head say:

 It won't work!
 It's a scam!
 It cost too much!
 I can't afford it!
 I can't do it!

 Or even worse, you shared your dream to become an investor with others and
they say:

 It's a scam!
 I tried it and it did not work!
 That's silly!
 You can't do that!

 It all comes back to The "Haves" and The "Have-Nots".

 The "Haves" operate with:

 Desire/Drive
 Commitment/Dedication
 Discipline
 Education
 Courage
 Determination
 Experience
 Perseverance
 Organization
 Optimism

 The "Have-Nots" operate with:

 Fear of the Unknown
 Procrastination
 Lack of Education
 Complacency
 Poor Self Control
 Fear of Success
 World of Scarcity
 Skepticism
 Low Self-Esteem
 Hopelessness

 All of us at some point in life have listened to voices of caution when it
comes to following dreams of success. If you and others around you question what
you do and thing, and you veer away from making decisions you are simply
stopping yourself from reaching your fullest potential as an investor.

 You are allowing this self-doubt and doubt from others to squeeze out your
creative energy and inspiration that will make you a success.

 So what is stopping you from making that important decision in selecting a
real estate education?

 FEAR

 Fear is the greatest single barrier to success as a real estate investor. The
emotion of fear is intended to warn us of danger and to act as a cautionary
tool. It should make us stop and think before acting. Not to squeeze out your
creative energy and inspiration that will make you a success.

 What fear shouldn't do is dictate the course of action you take. It shouldn't
control or shape whom you are or what you want to achieve as a real estate
investor.

 On a conscious or subconscious level, all of us have felt the impact of fear
in our lives. Whether it is the fear of making a decision, the fear of failure,
a fear of what other people will think, or the fear of success - the
consequences are the same.

 Fear leads you to stop trying new things. Your comfort zone pulls tight around
you and is rarely pushed further out than it needs to be. You feel stale,
lethargic and wonder what's missing in your life. Your creative energy is
replaced with a survival instinct. On a subconscious level, you start to really
believe that you aren't good enough, or that there's no way possible that you
can achieve becoming a real estate investor. On a conscious level your body and
mind responds to being fed negative statements.

 So what are you afraid of?

 What stops you from taking the next step forward that will keep you on the
path of achieving your goals?

 It's a low level of self-confidence and self-esteem that makes you feel
unhappy about yourself. Because your thoughts are based on feelings of
inadequacy, you set your boundaries and standards very low and achieve little in
your life.

 The emotion of fear is part of being human. It's perfectly normal to
experience misgivings and doubts!

 Fear will never go away no matter how self-confident or successful you are!
 The key to overcoming fear is to feel good about yourself and think
positively. Avoid negative people and then use that same energy that fear
creates and turn it into positive energy in your life.

 Only then can you turn indecision and fear into power and action.

 You have simply to choices to make one is to live your life in the arena of
The "Haves" or The "Have-Nots".

 Will you be a success? One will never know if you do not take the risk and
seek out your dreams of becoming an investor.

 Will you fail possibly so but with knowledge you can limit failure.

 You now have two simple choices!

 Choose education

 Or

 Choose not to educate! You simply make no change! Life goes on as is!


   John Michael
 Investor/Teacher/Mentor/Author
 Toll-Free: 1-877-225-5928 & enter 4178623164
Office - (775) 535-1341 & Fax - (775) 307-6541
Email: john@jmichaelrei.com or jmichaelrei@sbcglobal.net
JMichael Investments: www.jmichaelrei.com

Fear is a great motivator

But it should not lead your life.

I, personally am never lead by fear. However, there is a great difference
between fear being lead by fear and intelligent motivation.

Fear can keep you from doing something harmful like jumping off a cliff to
deep waters below. Intelligence will make you examine your fears and do a
reality check to see if: other people have done it? What were their success
rates?

Was anyone harmed in doing it before you?
This would be intelligent motivation put in place by the initial fear.
That is what I do.
That is why I do my research.
I do not allow fear to rule my life, but I do recognized if there are any
valid reasons for fear, and then research those reasons.

It does seem incredible to me that someone, namely DALE, uses the method of
belittling other people when they take another road from the one he would have
them do.

Stop it Dale. We recognize your very immature methods of trying to persuade
people when they are wrong because they do not agree with you.
I would question what the heck you are so afraid of, but I don't want to get
into a pissing match with you. I have seen that it leads nowhere and you never
truly address that issue at hand, you only find a way to call people fearful
and faithless.

Whatever, that's one of your faults that we have all come to recognize.
You need to admit that you personally try to use fear as a tactic to get
people to come to your own side. Why else would you make statements that tell
people they are never going to reach their dreams if they are too scared. That alone
is a scare tactic!   So you are the very instigator of what you criticize
others for doing!

Your cover is blown Dale.
Leave well enough alone and move onto something more inspiring.

Thanks.
Mel

How It All Began, Go To Vegas if You Want to Gamble!

Hey guys,

While it usually isn't my style to be "negative" or be on the attack, I can understand the frustration of trying to make a point for or against a system in such a limited medium such as this Yahoo! forum.Our heavy weight forum friends Dale and Phil, for example, can really go at it; and as amusing as it initially was, it can be a bit painstakingly tediuos and redundant at times.

There's no doubt these two passionately support their positions (to say the least). Maybe even to the degree that we have estranged people from the forum... and are slowly drifting from the original purpose of this forum. BUT the back and forth dialog is certainly not in vain - or at least the ORIGINAL intention of how this all began.

Why are we here?

What drew usto an obscure forum on the web about someone even more obscure??

If you're like me, you came to the web for answers to anagging feeling inthe back of your head about a person and his seminar(s) The purpose of this forum is really to help people decide about what to do with their hard earned 6k that they initially were gonna put into James Smith seminars.

Over the past 300+ posts and about 1.5 yrs later, I would hope there's enough personal experiences in the message archiveto achieve that goal.

Personally, I think I have made a decision about what to do with my 6k."Just the facts, ma'am "What is the criteria we're seeking to meet in order for us to feelcomfortable, confident, and ready to invest our hard earned ca$h into aprogram, system, seminar? For me it isn't the person's formal educationor how many homes under his name.

For me if I can't see the actualfigures and performance of past students, then all I have to rely on andsettle for are reviews and testimonials from past students... and fromwhat I find on the internet about the program in question.

Most people can't (and don't want to) take a CHANCE with someone to TRY a system out to see if it works for them.

1. it's a waste of money;
2.it's a waste of time; and
3. no one wants to waste their own resources just to take a chance.

Besides, if you want to gamble, that's what Vegas is for.

The goal is to minimize risk (we can never completelyremove it - that's where some faith is required), so that we are comfortable, confident, and ready to invest/take action/participate in the system.

Does this mean we don't take action in our lives just because we don't "take action" with this program? Of course not. We don't need to talk to the guy or meet him in person to make a decisionabout the seminar(s) he's trying to sell us.

I judge by consistentactions and historical trends - your actions speak louder than your presentation. and the company you keep, tells me enough about how you choose to conduct business.

Does this have anything to do with the knowledge and information that is included in the seminar? not necessarily, sure... BUT you just lost my confidence, comfort-level, and willingness to invest in the system (in the chance that there is valuable information) that you are trying to sell.

HOWEVER, that being said, there have been people who told me theywere taking the program in hopes to find any new tip/trick that can giveyou the boost/edge in the industry - and to them, that would be worth the investment.

Different strokes for different folks...Are there other systems/resources out there that provide the same promise of support and expertise that I am offered by this company?

Where? Who?--> YES. Our next superstar to bat may well be John Michael Real EstateGuru. I hope we can begin to move forward towards sharing the tools, systems,",

I hope we can begin to move forward towards sharing the tools, systems,
personal goals of self-improvement. James Smith and company isn't the only system that claims to bring you closer to your financial goals.

kram2004@gmail.com

Beware of Ulterior Motives [PART III]

Despite my request to stop copying content from the forum that he continues to use to build his "front" on the web, there was another attempt from him to post to the forum a message scattered with references of his website within the lengthy post.

Besides the blatant disregard for ethics and disrespect for request to cease the pilfering of material to be used for his personal gain on his website, there are THREE things that really bother me when all is said and done:

1. WHAT are his true intentions of hosting a duplicate forum with his slant on the web w/o the permission or cooperation of the forum from which he "borrows" the member posts to backfill his website?

2. WHY the need to hide his true affiliation with the company he left AND WHY the need to have a duplicate of the forum on the web under his control and manipulation? and lastly,

3. If you're truly looking out for the good of the public, then why not approach me to work with me to improve the forum instead of recreating an already functional forum?

Want to find his forum? Go here:
1. www.google.com
2. type in the name to search for: james smith

the search will take you to the search results page
(here's a shortcut http://tinyurl.com/mtrbv) where you will find
a sponsor link of James Smith RE Seminars at the top of the google search page;

UPDATED (as of 4/10/2006) - it looks like due to the cost of clicks to his site, he decided to remove the pay-per-click that he had subscribed to. oh well, we'll see what happens next. well, if you do stumble upon his site, you'll see what I'm talking about.

3. click on the sponsor link: "James Smith RE Seminars"

there you will find a duplication of content... where he plagerizes from the yahoo forum and to put onto his site posing to be a "neutral site" about James Smith.

BEWARE OF ULTERIOR MOTIVES [PART II]

A total of two attempts were made to post his copycat site before he finally emailed me:

PERSONAL EMAIL:
-------------------------

DATE: 02/24/2006

Jared Deheart wrote:
> Kramm,
> Please post the message on the board about the
> www.XXX-XXXX.com site. You will not even believe what is about to
> come our way!
> THE SHARK
>

---------------------
ha!

You will not even believe what is about to
> come our way!

please... to date (2/27/06), the site is just a duplicate of the members' postings to his webblog.

To which i replied:
----------------------------

DATE: 02/24/2006
kram wrote:

now really... WHY would i do something like that? you just recently
joined the forum, you refer to yourself as "we" indicating more than
just you (and who knows who else), and i know nothing of your background
or intentions... think about it. what would you do if our roles were
reversed? i know where i stand... a truly neutral party w/an open mind
to see the results of consistent actions of the public and the company
of james smith. the forum is fine for what it is/serves... a place to
communicate ideas... nothing more. you share your opinions and thots -
straightforward and simple.

-----------------
to which he replied:
-------------

DATE: 02/25/2006

Jared Deheart wrote:
> Kram,
> No problem. I just wanted you to be made aware of this. Believe me when
> I say that I am trying to assist others in their quest for knowledge. I
> can completely understand and respect your decision.
>
> Respectfully,
> CNNLEGAL

--------------------------

That was that, right?? WRONG. I mean, I thought I was pretty "nice" about how I handled things considering his blatant attempt to recreate the existing yahoo forum that he had stumbled upon just weeks ago. Setting up a website and recreating the forum in his own fashion to be served to the public as a seemingly neutral, innocent, "fact-finding" website about James Smith. I mean, what other motives could there be, being an EX-Coach for James Smith and company.. striking out on his own to start his own to sell his services and hopefully, possibly, conveniently picking up a few members from the Yahoo forum that so happens to be targetted specifically to his market of prospects?? After all, he states that he is only looking out for the good of the public!

oh come ON! I just can't stand people who aren't forthcoming with what they are REALLY after. At least admit in a "nice way" that you are looking to have a win-win solution by helping people attain their RE goals while building your business! What an insult to 1. setup a website in hopes to play it off as a truly neutral site wihtout any conflict of interest; 2. trying to conceal your full intentions with the noble facade/statement of "trying to assist others" (what a half-truth); and then, 3. outright copying content from the forum just to build your website with none of your own work or effort to fool future visitors who happen upon your site just to build a pool of prospects to sell your services to.

Frankly, these actions from Jared (aka: "THE SHARK") is on the same level of ethics that the RE guru industry is known for - deceptive and underhanded - promising the world with nothing to show for.

Alas, what can I do but deal with the reality that we live with all kinds of people and have to deal with the unethical ways of others. :( it's truly a pity.

SEE PART III

BEWARE OF ULTERIOR MOTIVES [PART I]

Recently I received a forum post on the yahoogroups requesting to advertise a particular webdomain to the group.

Generally, I have no problem approving messages that refer to other websites as long as they are relevant to the forum discussion. This post was different... this time the request was suspicious. it was a request from a former coach of the James Smith company - Jared Dehart (aka: CNNLEGAL or "THE SHARK") who recently joined the Yahoo! group (see http://tinyurl.com/qxcmk or message post #228 on the forum)

I was perplexed when I first saw this message post attempt to the forum:

----------------

Date: 02/23/2006

My Fellow Investors:

There is a new website focused on the all the facts that you've been wanting to know about James Smith. Come visit [such-and-such-website.com] to find out all about James Smith and subscribe to our daily newsletter to learn more. Here you will find material to help you become a successful real estate investor.

Kram, you have done an excellent job so far with this Yahoo forum, but we feel that with over 400 members it is time to take things to the next level.

THE SHARK

-----------

With an open mind, I decided to review the site to see what it had to offer...

LO AND BEHOLD... a complete duplication of the recent month's worth of forum posts from the James-Smith-Real-Estate-Guru Yahoo! Forum. This former coach of James Smith decided to recreate a forum in his own fashion and was attempting to pawn his site off as a place with all the answers. There were no tools or materials available for investors as stated in his message post that he had described. The site had graphics associated with the duplicated content, and reworded subject headings for each posting made from individuals of the forum.

I deleted the forum post and decided to not address the attempt to duplicate the forum for whatever intentions he had in mind.

SEE PART II

Re: Should I attend the NRI / James Smith 3 day training???? ANSW: NO! KEEP YOUR MONEY!!!!

I took 3-days seminar, I had a mentor for 12 sessions,
zero result, now I'm trying to get my money back. Nate
Day refused, if you are going to talk to him get ready
to hear pretty rude things. I'm done with dealing with
the company people to resolve my case.
Are you looking for advice? Take it or live it. Just
keep in mind that there is one more person out there
who already paid for the valuable lesson you can get
for free. TAKE ADVANTAGE!!!
-Elena.


--- devore barb wrote:

> To Wranglerblue 381,
>   I am a very conservative person and always do my
> research before acting on anything.  To say the
> least, I am very cautious and weigh everything
> before making a giant leap. Yet, after attending the
> all day presentation of 5 speakers, James was so
> convincing that I jumped when I shouldn't have, as
> far as I am concerned.  I went to the class and was
> bombarded with info. considering the fact that I
> knew very little to begin with and it was too much
> to understand all at once.  Then, after my friend
> and I left, we were convinced that anyone can do
> this and do it right away.  Wrong story.  It has
> been 9 months with a mentor and we have yet to
> accomplish our dream.  I dearly regret spending the
> money for the class, the mentor, and the software
> that Ryan Smith designed.  What a waste!  I'd love
> to do real estate but feel that one needs a personal
> mentor in the local area to assist you, just like
> James had and his son for that matter.  MY ADVICE:
> DON'T GO!  Learn from my mistake.
>   ..
..

James Smith National Real Estate Investors / NRI / MIT

I Went to the Scottsdale Celebrity conference. Yes, James is acharismatic speaker, but that's his job. I was caught up with theexcitement and wanted to plunk the big chunk of money down, but Ididn't have it available at the time.

It's a good thing.

After several attempts to contact the organization and emailing James himself with no reply tells me loud and clear what type oforganization they are running. Please use caution and research those who you plan to give and invest your hard earned money to. Please usecommon sense and remember if its too good to be true it probably is.If you have enough drive to take yourself to the conference, use thatdrive and put it into finding a local mentor or by doing your own footwork.

Yes it takes time but in time you will be rewarded and youcan be a mentor to someone else. Good luck everybody.

P.S. I found outthat the company is not a member with the Better Business Bureau.Google it and you'll see for yourself.

I Went to the Scottsdale Celebrity conference. Yes, James is acharismatic speaker, but that's his job. I was caught up with theexcitement and wanted to plunk the big chunk of money down, but Ididn't have it available at the time.

It's a good thing.

After several attempts to contact the organization and emailing James himself with no reply tells me loud and clear what type oforganization they are running. Please use caution and research those who you plan to give and invest your hard earned money to. Please usecommon sense and remember if its too good to be true it probably is.If you have enough drive to take yourself to the conference, use thatdrive and put it into finding a local mentor or by doing your own footwork.

Yes it takes time but in time you will be rewarded and youcan be a mentor to someone else. Good luck everybody.

P.S. I found outthat the company is not a member with the Better Business Bureau.Google it and you'll see for yourself.

Another Message To Dale, Like Talking to A Village Idiot?

Trying to reason with the village idiot is a futile effort. With
all of diversions you come with you sound like a politician.

Dale, you just don't get it. All you keep posting is the same
ridiculous advice - "go talk to James and he'll answer all of your
questions'. Sure he will, he's trying to talk me out of $6,000.00
to start with and more later.

The bottom line is this: James works for MIT as a paid speaker.
Nothing more, nothing less. He lives in a house that he bought in
1987 that has an approxiamte market value of $400K (this I have
verified through county records where he resides) which is not
indicative of a super-successful real estate investor. He professes
the merits of using corporations and trusts to shelter assets, yet
his personal residence is held in his own name. His son Ryan won't
provide any information to back up the representations he has posted
on his father's website. MIT/NRI (the company he works for) has a
very questionable background including some name changes, and from
other posts here do not honor their refund guarantee unless people
threaten to involve the BBB or the Utah AG. We don't hear anything
from the 'countless' people that he has helped. Put all this
together and what do you have? A salesman selling for a
questionable organization, pure and simple.

Dale, you have provided nothing to counter the above except for
saying that if we talk to James he'll tell us everything we need to
know. Again no facts, just your opinions of what YOU think of James
Smith. You give no facts that anyone can verify *except if we go
talk to James Smith). And since you give us NO VERIFIABLE FACTS,
your posts are completely worthless. You say 'collect the
evidence', but there isn't any.

BTW, are you going to counter cnnlegal's post? Since you know so
much about James Smith I really thought you'd be all over that one.

Come back with some real facts and maybe you'll sound more credible

The Battle Continues!

Dale-

Let me enlighten you about how the world works. The fact that James
Smith is on stage with the likes of Trump, Robbins, Ziglar, etc.
means nothing, They aren't there because they are doing James Smith
any favors, they are there because they are getting PAID to be
there. And yes, they will let any schmuck (even you Dale) on stage
with those guys if those guys are getting PAID to be there - they
are just collecting a check.

For that matter, you know WHY they have those personalities come
sales events where the likes of James Smith are selling? As
CNNLEGAL puts it, 'to put butts in seats'. You see, no one knows
who James Smith is, but everyone know who Trump is. That's an easy
sell. In fact, I would be surprised if Trump even remembered Smith
at all. If the event organizers did not have at least one
personality there the drw would be much less - that's why they spend
the money for people like Trump to be there.

James is the real deal IN YOUR EYES, but not in mine. He is a
salesman, not an investor. He is there for one reason; to sell the
training.

And one last thing, Dale. I may look angry, rigid and pathetic to
you, but judging by the responses that I get from my posts and the
responses to yours, my logic and quest for the facts is much more
credible than your 'go meet the man' and your 'faith'.

And I'll ask again. why should we take YOU at your word? Who the
hell are you?? Some self-appointed expert on James Smith? All you
tell us to do is go talk to him. What kind of due diligence is that?

Get real, Dale. You bring nothing to the table but your OPINION.
You need to go get some useful information and come back when you
have something of value to the group.

Phil

Should I attend the NRI/James Smith 3 day training????

I am a very conservative person and always do my research before acting on anything. To say the least, I am very cautious and weigh everything before making a giant leap. Yet, after attending the all day presentation of 5 speakers, James was so convincing that I jumped when I shouldn't have, as far as I am concerned. I went to the class and was bombarded with info. considering the fact that I knew very little to begin with and it was too much to understand all at once. Then, after my friend and I left, we were convinced that anyone can do this and do it right away. Wrong story. It has been 9 months with a mentor and we have yet to accomplish our dream. I dearly regret spending the money for the class, the mentor, and the software that Ryan Smith designed. What a waste! I'd love to do real estate but feel that one needs a personal mentor in the local area to assist you, just like James had and his son for that matter. MY ADVICE: DON'T GO! Learn from my mistake.

Barb DeVore

A James Smith Coach Speaks Up

My name is Sean Walker. I live in Utah. My phone number is(801)687-2999. I am a Personal Trainer in James program. I am also aRE investor for several years. You seek a sign Phil, so here yougo...I can witness to the fact that I have walked several studentsthrough some great deals both in residential and commercial RealEstate. They are real deals, with real people and real properties.Call me "shill" in James program if you wish, but I would take that asa complement!It's really none of your business to be looking at other investorsprivate deals. I would not tell you, for common sense and AssetProtection 101 reasons, what my personal deals have been. If you areso critical of James and his programs, that must make you an expert inReal Estate Investing as well. Why don't you share with the forum allof your personal financial information including where your propertiesare and how much your "net" gain was on each deal. Put that "Sue Me"sign on your back... If you were an experienced investor you wouldknow that a public records search on a seasoned investor should leadto a dead end. I don't do business in my own name for many good honestand ethical reasons, but mostly to shield my assets from "deadbeats"looking for free ride from frivolous lawsuits, not to mention thatdoing business in your own name offers much fewer tax breaks. Youraccountant should have filled you in on that little "secret" by now.

Sean Walker, nrisean@yahoo.com

Scheduled to Attend in March? Do we Go?

Hello,
I attended the Trump session of people selling ideas and ways to
become wealthy. My sister and I signed up for the Real Estate 3 day
course offered by James Smith. I usually do NOT spend that much money
just off the bat..I have learned from my father not to rush into
things...however, hopefully not sad to say, I did. So now we are
scheduled to attend Feb. 27-Mar 1, 2006 in Las Vegas. I had a bad
feeling about this the next day, but my sister wants to go. I don't
want to spend the $3,000 if I am not going to benefit from it. Nor, as
I have been reading, if I will be pressured to spend more on a 5 day
class.
I really need people to respond back on weather they felt it was
worth it or not, please help.

Thank you!
Ann

YOU TOO can become a public Speaker! Real Estate and Sex on the SAME DAY!

OK Guys,

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Here is the link so you can watch the video!
http://www.learningannex.com/virtual_classroom/data/promo/annex_promo_2.wmv

Here is all that you have to do to become a speaker just LIKE JAMES SMITH!

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Some of the Learning Annex's Previous Speakers & Instructors

Authors

*David Baldacci
*Barbara Taylor Bradford, author of A Woman Of Substance
*Ray Bradbury, author of The Martian Chronicles
*Betty Friedan, author of The Feminine Mystique, The Fountain of Age
*Jane Goodall, author of My Life With the Chimpanzees and Reason To Hope
*Spalding Gray, author of Swimming to Cambodia
*Winston Groom, author of Forrest Gump
*Joseph Heller, author of Catch-22
*Anne Lamott, author of Bird By Bird, Operating Instructions, Traveling Mercies
*Frances Mayes, author of Under the Tuscan Sun, Bella Tuscany
*Jay McInerney, author of Bright Lights, Big City
*James Redfield, author of The Celestine Prophecy
*Sidney Sheldon, author of The Other Side of Midnight, The Sky is Falling
*Kurt Vonnegut, Jr., author of Slaughterhouse Five
*Norman Mailer

Business Experts

*Donald Trump
*Russell Simmons, Def Jam Records, Phat Farm Clothing
*Robert Allen, author of Creating Wealth
*Richard Bolles, author of What Color is Your Parachute
*Herb Cohen, author of You Can Negotiate Anything
*Harry Dent, author of The Roaring 2000s Investor
*Mark Victor Hansen, motivational speaker & author of Chicken Soup for the Soul
*Jay Conrad Levinson, author of Guerilla Marketing
*Robert Kiyosaki, author of Rich Dad, Poor Dad
*Harvey Mackay, founder Mackay Envelopes, author of Swim with the Sharks
*Suze Orman, author The 9 Steps to Financial Freedom, The Courage to be Rich
*J. Peterman, chair and CEO of The J. Peterman Co.
*Lillian Vernon, founder & CEO of Lillian Vernon Corp.
*Michael Viner, President/CEO of Dove Entertainment
*Mel & Patricia Ziegler, founders of Banana Republic and Republic of Tea
*George Zimmer, founder of Men’s Wearhouse
*Stanley Mason, inventor of Velcro
*Pete Peterson, CEO of Blackstone Group

Film

*Allison Anders, screenwriter, Grace of My Heart and Gas, Food, Lodging
*Clive Barker, writer/director/producer
*Frank Darabont, director/producer/screenwriter, The Green Mile
*Paul Dooley, actor
*Robert Evans, producer of The Godfather
*Syd Field, author, screenwriter, script consultant, producer
*Robert McKee, screenwriter
*Elliott Gould, actor Friends
*Arthur Hiller, Pres. of Academy of Motion Picture Arts & Sciences
*Charlton Heston, Oscar-winning actor, Planet of the Apes
*Henry Jaglom, writer, director of Eating
*Janet Leigh, actress, Psycho
*Jerry Lewis, legendary film actor
*Richard Masur, Screen Actors Guild president
*Michael Medved, host of Sneak Preview
*James Moll, Oscar-Winning documentary filmmaker, The Last Days
*Lynda Obst, producer of Contact and Sleepless in Seattle
*Gary Ross, screenwriter/director, Pleasantville
*Steve Tisch, producer of Forrest Gump
*Kirk Douglas, Oscar-winning actor, Spartacus
*Anthony Quinn, actor, Revenge
*Paul Sorvino, actor, Goodfellas
*Kevin Bacon, actor, Footloose, Apollo 13
*Jay Mohr, actor, Jerry McGuire
*Sally Field, actress, Steel Magnolia
*Jill Clayburgh, actress
*Richard Dreyfuss, actor, Mr. Holland’s Opus

Fitness/Health/Healing/Nutrition

*Deepak Chopra
*Larry Dossey, author of Healing Power of Prayer
*Dr. John McDougall, nutrition pioneer & author
*Dr. Earl Mindell, nutrition expert & author
*Carolyn Myss, author Anatomy of the Spirit
*Christine Northrup, M.D., author of Women’s Bodies, Women’s Wisdom
*Dr. Dean Ornish, author of Reversing Heart Disease
*Susan Powter, fitness guru, Stop the Insanity!
*Dr. Barry Sears, medical pioneer & author of The Zone
*H. Leighton Steward, author, Sugar Busters
*Dr. Andrew Weil, author of Spontaneous Healing
*Dr. Aurthur Janov, Primal Scream founder and author
*Tony Little, “Americas Personal Trainer”
*Dr. Judith Orloff, author of Second Sight; psychiatrist and psychic
*Gary Null, health-and-fitness expert, and best-selling author

Internet/New Media

*Jonathan Shapiro, VP Business Development, Doubleclick
*Jerry Colonna, founding partner, Flatiron Partners
*Thomas R. Evans, CEO, GeoCities
*Dave Kansas, Editor-in-Chief, TheStreet.com
*Scott Kurnit, founder/ CEO, About.com
*Todd Krizelman & Stephan Paternot, founders/CEO’s, theglobe.com
*Felicia Lindau, Founder/CEO, Sparks.com
*Lee Nadler, CEO and President, Digital Pulp
*Craig Newmark, founder, Craigslist
*Dan Pelson, CEO, Concrete Media
*Stuart Skorman, founder, Reel.com
*David Talbot, founder, Salon.com
*Ann Winblad, co-founder, Hummer Winblad Venture Partners
*Josh Harris, Jupiter Communications, and Psuedo.com
*Dr. Scott Rigby, founder/president, thought bubble productions
*Seth Godin, YoYodyne Entertainment

Personal Growth

*Sylvia Browne, psychic and spiritual medium
*John Gray, author of Men are from Mars, Women are from Venus
*Dr. Barbara DeAnelis, acclaimed relationship expert
*Marianne Williamson, author/lecturer/spiritual teacher
*Richard Bach, best-selling author of Jonathan Livingston Seagull
*John Bradshaw, personal growth expert
*Dr. Nathaniel Branden, “father of the Self-Esteem Movement”
*Dannion Brinkley, best-selling author of Saved By The Light
*Les Brown, author of Live Your Dreams
*Julia Cameron author of The Artist’s Way
*Jack Canfield, author of Chicken Soup for the Soul
*Dr. Morton Cooper, voice coach to the stars
*Laura Day, author of Practical Intuition
*Ram Dass, author of Be Here Now and Still Here
*Dr. Wayne Dyer, Author of Your Erroneous Zones
*Betty Eadie, author of Embraced by the Light
*Dr. Albert Ellis, creator of Rational Emotive Therapy and author
*Uri Geller, world renowned psychic
*Daniel Goleman Ph.D., author of Emotional Intelligence
*Thich Nhat Hanh, author of 35 books
*Louise Hay, pioneer of the self-help movement
*Jean Houston, pioneer of the Human Potential Movement
*Jon Kabat-Zinn, Ph.D., best-selling author on meditation
*Sam Keen, author of Fire in the Belly, leader in the men’s movement
*George Leonard, author of Mastery
*Dan Millman, author of Way of the Peaceful Warrior
*M. Scott Peck, author of The Road Less Traveled
*Tony Robbins, success coach & best-selling author
*Dr. Bernie Siegel, best-selling author of Love, Medicine, and Miracles
*Dr. Huston Smith, philosophy professor & author
*Dr. Brian Weiss, past-life regression expert, author, Many Lives, Many Masters
*Marianne Williamson, author/lecturer/spiritual teacher
*Iyanla Vanzant, author In the Meantime, One Day My Soul Opened Up
*Dr. Arthur Janov, Primal Scream founder and author
*Martha Beck, author, Find your True North Star

Psychics/Intuitives

*George Anderson, author of Lessons from the Light
*Sylvia Browne, author of The Other Side and Back
*Char, psychic
*Laura Day, author of Practical Intuition
*Betty Eadie, author of Embraced By The Light
*John Edward, author of One Last Time
*Uri Geller, world-renowned psychic
*Judith Orloff, author of Second Sight
*James Van Praagh, author of Talking to Heaven
*Doreen Virtue, psychic

Politics

*Betty Friedan, The Feminine Mystique, The Fountain of Age
*Abbie Hoffman, political activist
*Arianna Huffington, author of How to Overthrow the Government
*Ed Koch, former mayor of New York City
*Jerry Rubin, hippy turned yuppie
*Governor Jesse Ventura, Governor of Minnesota
*Naomi Wolf, feminist, author of The Beauty Myth
*Henry Kissinger

Sex/Intimacy/Relationships

*John Gray, author Men Are From Mars, Women Are From Venus
*Dr. Laura Schlessinger, national radio personality
*Dr. Barbara DeAngelis, acclaimed relationship expert

Television/Music

*Jason Alexander, star of Seinfeld
*Ron Wood, of the Rolling Stones
*Wynton Marsalis, jazz musician
*Phil Ramone, award-winning music producer
*Joan Rivers, E! Host
*Brooke Shields, model, actress on Suddenly Susan
*Candace Bushnell, author, Sex and the City
*Nancy Cartwright, voice of Bart Simpson
*Clive Davis, President, Arista Records
*Paul Dooley, actor Grace Under Fire, The Practice
*Max Weinberg, musician E Street Band
*Nora Dunn, comedienne, Saturday Night Live
*Phil Hartman, comedian, actor
*Mickey Hart, original member of The Grateful Dead
*Marilu Henner, actress Taxi, Evening Shade
*Winnie Holzman, writer/producer Once and Again
*Gordon Hunt, director of Mad About You and Coach
*Jerry Springer, television talk-show host
*Larry King, CNN host
*Vicki Lawrence, Emmy award-winning actress
*Kenny Loggins, singer/songwriter
*Ray Manzarek, co-founder of The Doors
*Camryn Manheim, actress The Practice
*Jay Mohr, actor, Action
*Doris Roberts, actress, Everybody Loves Raymond
*Nile Rodgers, Grammy award-winning producer
*Al Roker, host of the Today Show
*Michael Richards, star of Seinfeld
*Christopher Titus, actor, Titus
*Sarah Jessica Parker, actress Sex & the City
*Ernie Anastos, Emmy award-winning news anchor
*Jamie-Lynn Sigler, actress, Sopranos
*William Shatner, actor, Star Trek

Restaurant/Food Industry

*Wally Amos, “Famous Amos” cookies
*Roki Aoki, founder of Benihana
*Ben Cohen, founder of Ben & Jerry’s
*Rueben Mattus, founder of Haagen Daz
*David Mintz, Founder of Tofutti
*Julee Russo, Founder of the Silver Pallette
*Vincent Sardi Jr., owner of Sardi’s
*Andre Soltner, chef and owner of Lutece
*Faith Stewart Gordon, Russian Tea Room
*Tim Zagat, restaurant critic, founder of Zagat’s
*Steve Hansen, Ruby Foo’s
*Paul Kolaj, Famiglia Pizza

Sports

*Waltz Frazier, NY Knicks and Hall-of-Famer
*Earl Monroe, NY Knicks and Hall-of-Famer
*Bud Harrelson, NY Mets shortstop and coach in 90’s
*Joe Mcllvaine, GM of NY Mets
*George Young, GM of NY Giants
*Fred Clair, GM of LA Dodgers
*Phil Mcconkey, NY Giants player
*Bill Walton, played w/Portland Trailblazers and Boston Celtics, Hall-of-Famer, currently sports announcer

Fashion/Personalities

*Ivana Trump
*Joan Rivers
*Elle MacPherson, model
*Brooke Shields, model, actress, spokesperson
*Vendela, model
*Carol Alt, model
*Simon Doonan, Barneys window-dresser and author
*Barbara Cirkva, EVP Chanel
*Malia Mills
*Josie Natori
*Jane Schoenborn, creator, Jane Fox handbags
*Reed Krakoff, CEO Coach
*Ed Burstell, GM of Henri Bendel
*Diane Von Furstenburg
*Paul Charron, CEO Liz Claiborne
*Mario Buatta, interior designer

A Message from Dale

The Saga Continues .....

OK, we've got one more great testimony about James from someone who actually MET him ..
Just for the record, if you've never met James, and you are just giving your testimony based on what you find online or from private eyes, then your perception is FALSE.

Let me explain it this way. I'm sure you have all heard about the story about the six blind men and the elephant, but I'll tell it anyway.

Six blind men are traveling down a road, trying to feel their way forward.
They stumble upon an elephant blocking their path.

Each man feels a different part of the elephant, and through their LIMITED perception (like when you don't actually meet someone before making a judgement about them), they come up with different conclusions.

One man touches the trunk and says it's a snake. One touches the ear and says it's a fan. One touches the leg and says it's a tree.

One touches the tusk and says it's a spear. One touches the tail and says it's a rope. One touches the side and says it's a wall.

All of them are wrong, but BY THEIR PERCEPTIONS they think they are right and they will defend their assertations vehemntly, including bashing people in an online forum. Even people that are just trying to set the record straight for the many observers of this room.
Mel, I'm not insulting anyone. I'm just trying to point out that some people's perceptions are misguided and that they need a broader view. I'm sure a private eye can dig up lots of dirt on ANYONE.

You'd be suprised who has an FBI file.

And Phil, if you don't take the time to actually open your eyes and see what the "elephant" truely is, and just spend your time online trying to find dirt and defend your position, then you are BLIND.

Think of it this way. Are you SURE? REALLY sure? Bet your life on your opinion of James?
Well, if not, then you don't have all the info you need. And you won't get it here.
You will always be blind unless you go to meet James and ask him your questions in person.
You won't find them here.

Dale

PS. Can you refute that? Can you REALLY refute that? Isn't that absolute truth? I mean, REALLY the truth?

HOW IT ALL STARTED...

From: "KRAM"
Date: Fri Oct 1, 2004 1:52 pm
Subject: Who is James Smith and his National Real Estate Investors organization?

About a week ago I had attempted to contact all people who had email
links from various websites re: James Smith and his travelling
seminar.  As you may have discovered already from doing a web search,
there is not much conclusive information on James Smith.

EMAILS:

As for the feedback that I have received so far, it has been few and
far between; Unfortunately, none of them were quite convincing or
conclusive:

1. One basically told me that it wasn't worth the money if you're
just starting out with no RE background (cuz there's just so much
info that's covered).

2. Another told me that it was well worth his money and would take
him again if he were to do it over again.

3. The rest were sitting on the fence waiting to hear more about this
guy.


GURU RATINGS:

I've also checked with several sites that rate gurus -

1. www.johntreed.com
2. www.foreclosures.com
3. www.mazu.com
4. www.papersourceonline.com

but none have any information on James Smith, except for the last one
listed (
http://www.papersourceonline.com/discus/messages/1649/12593.html?1095459508 ).
I've also tried contacting the admins of the sites
listed above, but I'm sure they're too busy to answer the my query.

Lastly, I've tried posting on several forums to see if i could get
any feedback...  Nothing substantial... only emails from other people
inquiring.  I know of one or two that are attending soon.  We'll see
how they do.

YOUR FINDINGS:
If anyone has any information to share about James Smith OR any
promising program, guru, book, or other resource, please do not
hesitate to share with the group.  This forum documents all our posts
and will become a valuable resource for other newbies clueless of
what is out there.  In the spirit of community and plain generosity,
your contribution is much appreciated.

We can benefit many times over from the collaborative effort and
quality of contribution that we put into this - of course, this idea
applies to many things outside of this forum.

Thanks for your time,
- K